Some 4thEd News
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Some 4thEd News
I got this from a email list server I subscribe to - FR DM's.
he following is from http://www.enworld.org .
There's a new official podcast up, and it's all about the Forgotten Realms Campaigh Setting. EN World member PeterWeller has kindly transcribed the important details:
*Red Wizards are led by Zsass (sp? that lich guy). They're scarier and so is Thay. The enclave Red Wizards are unwelcome expatriates who can't return home.
*They avoided ret-conning, instead writing story explanations for the changes, they reiterated the policy that FR should be able to include anything in D&D, and they said they used particularly tough fits as opportunities for creativity.
*There was more talk about bringing back a sense of wonder and mystery for old players while making the setting accessible to new players, but at the same time, they made sure that the veteran FR fan's library wasn't rendered obsolete. There are supposed to be a lot of "easter eggs" for long time fans of the setting.
*Rich made it a particular point that they weren't trying to shoe horn every setting into the PoL philosophy.
*Most entries in the book are two pages, but some, like Waterdeep's are longer. (Waterdeep's is six pages.) The entries concentrate more on adventure hooks and settings than history.
*Ed is part of the merging of two worlds stuff. Bruce and Rich spoke excitedly about his contributions to the book. They also mentioned that he had written a 100+ page fluff bible for 4E Waterdeep, and that he was writing a novel series set in and around Waterdeep.
*The book contains a starting adventure set in Loudwater, and is designed so that you can roll up some characters, play the starting adventure, and then start using the rest of the book to run a campaign. This is for new players who have no idea what FR is about.
*There's a fifty page chapter covering villain groups, NPC antagonists, and monsters specific to FR.
There's probably other stuff I forgot, but that's a bunch of it. The only thing they really went into detail on were the changes to the Red Wizards. It was more talk about their design philosophy in regards to FR in 4E.
he following is from http://www.enworld.org .
There's a new official podcast up, and it's all about the Forgotten Realms Campaigh Setting. EN World member PeterWeller has kindly transcribed the important details:
*Red Wizards are led by Zsass (sp? that lich guy). They're scarier and so is Thay. The enclave Red Wizards are unwelcome expatriates who can't return home.
*They avoided ret-conning, instead writing story explanations for the changes, they reiterated the policy that FR should be able to include anything in D&D, and they said they used particularly tough fits as opportunities for creativity.
*There was more talk about bringing back a sense of wonder and mystery for old players while making the setting accessible to new players, but at the same time, they made sure that the veteran FR fan's library wasn't rendered obsolete. There are supposed to be a lot of "easter eggs" for long time fans of the setting.
*Rich made it a particular point that they weren't trying to shoe horn every setting into the PoL philosophy.
*Most entries in the book are two pages, but some, like Waterdeep's are longer. (Waterdeep's is six pages.) The entries concentrate more on adventure hooks and settings than history.
*Ed is part of the merging of two worlds stuff. Bruce and Rich spoke excitedly about his contributions to the book. They also mentioned that he had written a 100+ page fluff bible for 4E Waterdeep, and that he was writing a novel series set in and around Waterdeep.
*The book contains a starting adventure set in Loudwater, and is designed so that you can roll up some characters, play the starting adventure, and then start using the rest of the book to run a campaign. This is for new players who have no idea what FR is about.
*There's a fifty page chapter covering villain groups, NPC antagonists, and monsters specific to FR.
There's probably other stuff I forgot, but that's a bunch of it. The only thing they really went into detail on were the changes to the Red Wizards. It was more talk about their design philosophy in regards to FR in 4E.
In War: Resolution. In Defeat: Defiance. In Victory: Magnanimity. In Peace: Goodwill.
- Shir'le E. Illios
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Yeah, I saw that. Thanks Talwyn. Tried to listen to it too, but that didn't last long.
I'm not sure what I think about "easter eggs"; I don't want Eilistraee to become an easter egg ("see here this site where once upon a time long ago a shrine for some good drow goddess stood"... yeah, that'll be fun ).
As always though, I'm putting all my thoughts and feelings regarding 4E and 4E FR on hold until I know what happens to Eilistraee. Because without her there really is no point in sticking with any official publications.
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Shir'le
I'm not sure what I think about "easter eggs"; I don't want Eilistraee to become an easter egg ("see here this site where once upon a time long ago a shrine for some good drow goddess stood"... yeah, that'll be fun ).
As always though, I'm putting all my thoughts and feelings regarding 4E and 4E FR on hold until I know what happens to Eilistraee. Because without her there really is no point in sticking with any official publications.
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Shir'le
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I'm currently actually considering maybe seeing into converting 3/3.5E stuff into 4E; can always use the rules and not the exact setting.
For instance, with the [url=http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dn ... a:2jzjosz2]Angels Excerpt[/url:2jzjosz2] they released today I've been wondering what kind of angelic servants Eilistraee would have (probably some black-skinned being with long, flowing white hair like cascading moonlight and crescent-moon-shaped wings; for the Masked Lady they'd probably have one black and one white wing). Could have all kinds of fun just making up our own stuff.
But let's see what they're going to do first. Besides, it seems that even if they don't axe her there still won't be any further books to buy. The only thing I'm wondering is if it'd be possible to get any articles from DDI without paying for the monthly subscription (and just paying for the articles).
But anyway, we'll just have to see.
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Shir'le
For instance, with the [url=http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dn ... a:2jzjosz2]Angels Excerpt[/url:2jzjosz2] they released today I've been wondering what kind of angelic servants Eilistraee would have (probably some black-skinned being with long, flowing white hair like cascading moonlight and crescent-moon-shaped wings; for the Masked Lady they'd probably have one black and one white wing). Could have all kinds of fun just making up our own stuff.
But let's see what they're going to do first. Besides, it seems that even if they don't axe her there still won't be any further books to buy. The only thing I'm wondering is if it'd be possible to get any articles from DDI without paying for the monthly subscription (and just paying for the articles).
But anyway, we'll just have to see.
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Shir'le
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Eilistraee's Angels...
[img:3aynapc0]http://www.lineage2.com/news/images/New ... border.jpg[/img:3aynapc0]
...Kind of like that?
[img:3aynapc0]http://www.lineage2.com/news/images/New ... border.jpg[/img:3aynapc0]
...Kind of like that?
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[quote="Ix'Chimalxochitzin":2kad421z]Eilistraee's Angels...
...Kind of like that?[/quote:2kad421z]
Not quite. That's too... normal; too human(/elven). The 4E angels are less like the stereotypical angel image of a human with wings, less of an image of purity and goodness; to quote the excerpt I linked above:
"The change in angels’ nature paved the way to a change in appearance as well. Angels became less humanoid in appearance, more like impartial embodiments of immortal power. They are faceless, sometimes metallic or stonelike in form, trailing into Astral essence. No halos here—these are beings created for a purpose, rather than anthropomorphic images of comfort and purity. They are uncaring and relentless, and their new look reinforces that aspect."
What I'm thinking of leans more in this direction:
[img:2kad421z]http://www.comicmonsters.com/CMimages/mkprof.jpg[/img:2kad421z]
Though instead of a cape, imagine smooth (i.e. featherless) 'wings' like shards of moonlight, instead of a hood imagine white hair like moonfire and a black, faceless head with piercing red eyes. The upper body could be male or female-like in appearance, but again a smooth black like an obsidian statue and instead of legs the lower body disappearing into a mist of shadows. And swords of course; they'd have swords.
Yes, I realize my description completely changed the picture above.
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Shir'le
...Kind of like that?[/quote:2kad421z]
Not quite. That's too... normal; too human(/elven). The 4E angels are less like the stereotypical angel image of a human with wings, less of an image of purity and goodness; to quote the excerpt I linked above:
"The change in angels’ nature paved the way to a change in appearance as well. Angels became less humanoid in appearance, more like impartial embodiments of immortal power. They are faceless, sometimes metallic or stonelike in form, trailing into Astral essence. No halos here—these are beings created for a purpose, rather than anthropomorphic images of comfort and purity. They are uncaring and relentless, and their new look reinforces that aspect."
What I'm thinking of leans more in this direction:
[img:2kad421z]http://www.comicmonsters.com/CMimages/mkprof.jpg[/img:2kad421z]
Though instead of a cape, imagine smooth (i.e. featherless) 'wings' like shards of moonlight, instead of a hood imagine white hair like moonfire and a black, faceless head with piercing red eyes. The upper body could be male or female-like in appearance, but again a smooth black like an obsidian statue and instead of legs the lower body disappearing into a mist of shadows. And swords of course; they'd have swords.
Yes, I realize my description completely changed the picture above.
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Shir'le
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Being an angel fanatic, I have to say the words uncaring and relentless are disturbing to me. Changes in appearance doesn't bother me at all, since it was always the being and not the body, the concept, the essence of them that fascinated me. But the thought that they are to become nothing more than soulless embodiments of divine will...they might as well just be avatars, because what seems to be taking place is having everything that makes an angel an angel (i.e. being a symbol of comfort and purity) is being completely removed, and only the word angel is remaining.
Angels pretending to be angels, in other words. This is my view on things.
Angels pretending to be angels, in other words. This is my view on things.
Harl l'drathir udos alure, Eilistraee lu'Anixiel ulu kyorl udossa zuch
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[quote="Narsia Ny'Dhun":177635a3]Angels pretending to be angels, in other words. This is my view on things.[/quote:177635a3]
Yeah, I can see that. Would've been better if they'd given them a different name and kept real angels as the Good counter to Demons and Devils (unattached to any deity as well).
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Yeah, I can see that. Would've been better if they'd given them a different name and kept real angels as the Good counter to Demons and Devils (unattached to any deity as well).
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Shir'le
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I think that they just hybridized angels to fit both good and evil goddesses' pantheons. Personally, i agree with Narsia that Angels should be Angels, and Demons should be Demons, but not generalise Angels into a common denomer like the gods' messengers, servants and errand boys/girls.
Though personally, i can imagine how an Angel of Eilistraee's would appear to be like a former Ilythiiri elf: Her goal is to bring redemption to the Dark Elves, and what better way for a being created by her to appear than as what a Dark Elf would look like if the Curse had been lifted from them? It is her goal, the very reason why she chose to be banished to the Underdark as well, so her Angels should reflect that imho. That the result appears almost, but not quite, elven is an unintentional side effect.
Shir'le, the pic you posted looks like an Angel of Vhaeraun's if he were still alive. It fits his style much better.
Though personally, i can imagine how an Angel of Eilistraee's would appear to be like a former Ilythiiri elf: Her goal is to bring redemption to the Dark Elves, and what better way for a being created by her to appear than as what a Dark Elf would look like if the Curse had been lifted from them? It is her goal, the very reason why she chose to be banished to the Underdark as well, so her Angels should reflect that imho. That the result appears almost, but not quite, elven is an unintentional side effect.
Shir'le, the pic you posted looks like an Angel of Vhaeraun's if he were still alive. It fits his style much better.
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[quote="Shir'le E. Illios":n0nn1gbu]"The change in angels’ nature paved the way to a change in appearance as well. Angels became less humanoid in appearance, more like impartial embodiments of immortal power. They are faceless, sometimes metallic or stonelike in form, trailing into Astral essence. No halos here—these are beings created for a purpose, rather than anthropomorphic images of comfort and purity. They are uncaring and relentless, and their new look reinforces that aspect."....[/quote:n0nn1gbu]
Those are the "new" angels hmm? That sounds rather grotesque to me. More like golems than angels really. (Exactly what is wrong with the "traditional" angel image anyway?) However the more I find out about the newer D&D releases I must admit I'm liking things less and less.
Now, as to Eilistraee's angels, the crescent moon shaped wings sound quite nice. (Faceless angels still scare me though.) I'm going to have to see if I can find a good example of those wings. They would make a nice addition to NWN.
Those are the "new" angels hmm? That sounds rather grotesque to me. More like golems than angels really. (Exactly what is wrong with the "traditional" angel image anyway?) However the more I find out about the newer D&D releases I must admit I'm liking things less and less.
Now, as to Eilistraee's angels, the crescent moon shaped wings sound quite nice. (Faceless angels still scare me though.) I'm going to have to see if I can find a good example of those wings. They would make a nice addition to NWN.