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Basics:
Hit Die: d10
Skills: 2+int (x4 at 1st level)
BAB: as Cleric
Saves: as Cleric
Spells: as Wizard (all casting is however spontaneous)
Spell List: any and only spells that deal [b:pszk9wqv][i:pszk9wqv][u:pszk9wqv]DIRECT[/u:pszk9wqv][/i:pszk9wqv][/b:pszk9wqv] damage.
Martial Maneuvers: 2 at first, 1 every even level
Maneuvers Readied: 2 at first, 1 every third

Special Abilities:
Battle Caster (Light) at 1st medium at 5th and heavy at 10th
Battlemage’s Edge: As Warmage Edge
Martial Maneuvers: Battlemages may choose a single school from the Book of Nine swords to study, can choose a second school at level 10

The Battlemage is a class inspired by a campaign setting that myself and a number of friends have created in which magic itself is a religion, Four different ones infact. Arcane magic, Nature based Magic, Divine Magic and Blade Magic all vie for supremacy.

The Battlemage represents a melding of all four traditions, such people are rare and often reguarded as Heretics and blasphemers by the common populace they are veiwed by the nations of the world as powerful mercenaries and sell swords capable of turning the tide of a battle even when in small numbers.

Although Battlemages lack the sheer ferocity of a dedicated warrior and a caster will veiw their spell casting as heavy handed at best and a brutal rape of delicate magic at worst, they are as capable of calling lightning from the sky to stop an armored man in his tracks as they are of sinking a sword into the guts and an unprotected spell caster.

I'd have to say i voted 'broken'. You're effectively playing a Cleric with a higher hit die than normal who gets a free 'cast in any armor you want' pass, the Wizards' spell list (restricted to direct damage spells) as well as a Sorcerer's spontaneous casting, axing the need to memorise spells in advance. Oh, and though not as proficient as a full warrior, they can still hold their own in melee range.

Umm... I'd have to say i never heard of the Book of Nine Swords so i can't say whether or not its actually overpowered, but to me this translates into D&D terms as a Cleric that worships a number of Gods at once. Since you noted that the four branches are all fighting for supremacy, i doubt whatever Gods power them would look too kindly to people incorporating other magic branches into their combat styles.

But that's just my two cents though.

the Book of Nine Swords

is a 3.5 splat book, that is one of the guiding design souce for 4th Edition, the other being SAGA Star Wars.

[quote="Ix'Chimalxochitzin":3r98ra24]I'd have to say i voted 'broken'. You're effectively playing a Cleric with a higher hit die than normal who gets a free 'cast in any armor you want' pass, the Wizards' spell list (restricted to direct damage spells) as well as a Sorcerer's spontaneous casting, axing the need to memorise spells in advance. Oh, and though not as proficient as a full warrior, they can still hold their own in melee range.

Umm... I'd have to say i never heard of the Book of Nine Swords so i can't say whether or not its actually overpowered, but to me this translates into D&D terms as a Cleric that worships a number of Gods at once. Since you noted that the four branches are all fighting for supremacy, i doubt whatever Gods power them would look too kindly to people incorporating other magic branches into their combat styles.

But that's just my two cents though.[/quote:3r98ra24]

It's fine, the class is a work in progress. I designed this class as a way of keeping spell casting in one of my games where the Book of Nine Swords base classes had come to dominate play and I was aiming to allow it to keep the pace with those classes.

To give you some idea of what I tried to balance this class against I'll give you an example of a couple maneuvers available to a third level Warblade.

One called Emerald Razor makes your next attack a touch attack. though the scariest is probably Insightful Strike in which you roll an attack and if it hits you make a concentration check instead of rolling damage and take the Check's result as your damage instead, no bonuses, no multipliers. Thats 1d20 + Con bonus +6 at THIRD level, and they can do this every other round where as my class's maneuvers are limited to once per encounter.

So you'd suggest knocking the BAB down a touch, limiting the spell list a little more (perhaps to a certain number of energy types?) and making their casting a prepared thing?

The setting this class is designed for views magic itself as a religion, no gods, just magic. Those of the Arcane variety view Magic much the same as modern people view quantum physics, Naturalists view it as a force of nature like Ki or Karma while Blade mages view it as something in born and deists view magic itself as divine.

The concept behind this class is that of someone who has put aside all of the Dogma and embraced magic as a whole. There are still divine and profane powers but they exist more to serve an idea than a living god.

[quote="Alak Xiltyn":22ovuvv2]So you'd suggest knocking the BAB down a touch, limiting the spell list a little more (perhaps to a certain number of energy types?) and making their casting a prepared thing?

The setting this class is designed for views magic itself as a religion, no gods, just magic. Those of the Arcane variety view Magic much the same as modern people view quantum physics, Naturalists view it as a force of nature like Ki or Karma while Blade mages view it as something in born and deists view magic itself as divine.[/quote:22ovuvv2]

Well, the main problem is exactly what you mentioned. Since they're four different ways of seeing what magic is (radically different for people to fight over them, anyway) a Battlemage will have a hard time trying to master all four of those ways at once. Then, there's the skepticism from what would effectively be his magic teachers that would be hoklding him back as well.

The BAB isn't the problem, the Cleric has a decent warrior/caster hybrid progression anyway. The spell list would need to be memorised in advance to get into the correct mindset for the spells though, Blade magic will likely not be cast the same way as Nature based magic or 'standard' Arcane, so i can see how they'd need to make mental preparations for specific spells rather than cast 'on the fly' like a Sorcerer can. Because this would take them more time than a 'dedicated' Wizard, i'd say... -1 spell slot/spell level? That way, a Battlemage dedicated to casting solely Arcane wouldn't have the advantage over a 'pure' Arcane Mage through their massive hit die (tone this down to d8 btw, still twice as much as a pure Wizard, the -1 spell slots should hopefully counter this) and other (secondary) advantages.

Drop the Battle Caster (heavy) as a free feat as well though, and replace it (or Battle Caster (medium), iffy about that as well) with Spell Penetration, which is more useful in the long run and doesn't railroad every Battlemage into having an AC higher than their HP. If people want a Battlemage with at least some degree of Dex, they aren't wasting feats.

Alternatively, since the background appears to imply knowledge of all branches of Magic, you could just bump the whole thing up to Prestige Class with casting 5th level spells, Lore (magic) at 5+ and Battle Caster (light) as prerequisites and play with the free feats a little. Again, spell penetration would be nice, considering the knowledge the Battlemage would have on the effectiveness of spells against certain (magical or nonmagical) defenses.

But again, i never read the book, so i'm still comparing it to D&D here. Oh wells, just tossing up a few ideas.

[quote="Ix'Chimalxochitzin":p2q0ntro]

Well, the main problem is exactly what you mentioned. Since they're four different ways of seeing what magic is (radically different for people to fight over them, anyway) a Battlemage will have a hard time trying to master all four of those ways at once. Then, there's the skepticism from what would effectively be his magic teachers that would be holding him back as well.

[/quote:p2q0ntro]

Fortunately the HOW of it is fairly straight foreward anyone wishing to play the class has to explain where they learned their skills. I'll use the character that inspired the class as an example.

He was born into the Royal family of an arcane city, grew up among naturalists (where his mother was from) was sent as a diplomat to a Kingdom of Blade magic and helped them fight a war, and was captured by divine mages over the course of that war before negotiating a peace treaty. (most of which happened in game time as he went from a 1st level druid to a 5 Druid/ 5 Wizard/ 5 Fighter/ 5 Cleric)

Thanks again for the input, I really appreciate it, when I have more time I'll write up a version for use in standard D&D.

You say this is for your own campaign setting? If so whether or not this class is broken or not depends on if it is balanced with the REST of your setting. Me and a friend once made a setting where even your average peasant could give a Faerun adventurer a run for his money.

[quote="Tyrmer":t5qbhjrc]You say this is for your own campaign setting? If so whether or not this class is broken or not depends on if it is balanced with the REST of your setting. Me and a friend once made a setting where [b:t5qbhjrc]even your average peasant could give a Faerun adventurer a run for his money[/b:t5qbhjrc].[/quote:t5qbhjrc]

[img:t5qbhjrc]http://img373.imageshack.us/img373/9750 ... 3c0mg3.jpg[/img:t5qbhjrc]

[img:t5qbhjrc]http://home.versatel.nl/piccone/Smilies/whistling.gif[/img:t5qbhjrc]

I don't personally have an opinion, I just thought I'd tell you that I will direct one of my friends here to look at your class, and he won't be too lazy to read all the rule related jargon. He knows the manuals, D&D, and how certain abilities affect play and will be able to tell you a lot.

Well, granted I am lazy, but this class actually seems ok to me...I know some of you will disagree, but too bad it's my opinion and I am not changing it!

I appreciate the fact somebody besides me used the Book of Nine Swords as part of a cross class.

First however I need to know a couple things if you want advice on your class:

1. Are you foucused more on long range or short range combat?

2. Are there any bonus feats involved with this class?

3. What (in terms of equipment) can this class use in a fight?

4. What skills can be used by this class?

5. Finally for your special abilities, how many times per day can you use them?

If you need or want any advice just PM me. I hope to hear from you soon.

[quote="Avin Jingzu":2zp9s40q] 1. Are you foucused more on long range or short range combat? [/quote:2zp9s40q]

I went for flexability, I have them there for what ever variety of damage the party happens to be lacking, I gave them the armor feats so that they can live through hand to hand but can still stand back and fling fire balls if thats what is needed.

[quote="Avin Jingzu":2zp9s40q] 2. Are there any bonus feats involved with this class? [/quote:2zp9s40q] No, though I'm considering changing the armored caster feats to bonus feats and creating a feat list.

[quote="Avin Jingzu":2zp9s40q] 3. What (in terms of equipment) can this class use in a fight? [/quote:2zp9s40q] forgot this, All simple and martial melee weapons.

[quote="Avin Jingzu":2zp9s40q] 4. What skills can be used by this class? [/quote:2zp9s40q] another one I forgot, I'll have to dig that list out when I have more time.

[quote="Avin Jingzu":2zp9s40q] 5. Finally for your special abilities, how many times per day can you use them? [/quote:2zp9s40q]
Martial maneuvers can be used once per encounter while spells follow the wizard's progression.
[/quote]

Alright then, just so you know, as soon as this guy takes an Archmage level and goes for that element substitution thing (it's way too late at night to look it up) he'll be able to cast almost all offensive spells by changing the element to force.

Another thing, you may want to upgrade his equipment list just a bit so he can use better weapons.

Last thing, if you want to send me the skills and everything, I can fine tune it for you and send it back to you as a finished class...(I may be able to add in a couple other things from "the Tome of Magic" book as well... love them pact mages)

Ok then...I'll have to send you some of my character class idea's as well. I hope to hear from you soon.

Sorry I havn't been around, work has been chaos. Feel free to send me those classes, though it may be a while before I get to write out my skill list.